[Rockhounds] ID help

Tue Jun 23 17:01:12 PDT 2009

Well, As I am pretty ignorant about this fluorescence business, I don't know 
which end of the light does what! It is the upper lamp of my dual purpose 
Raytech light. I looked again, and it is possible that the red glow is a 
reflection off of the lustrous crystal surface. It is a weak, dark cherry 
red color concentrated at the edges of the crystal. Hard to tell.

Quartz will not scratch this spec, so it seems to me the choices are Topaz, 
Corundum, or Diamond. As Earl says, the region does produce a lot of Topaz. 
I have to go with that, although it is not the usual "blocky" prism seen in 
that mineral.

As Corundum, it would have to be Sapphire and very gemmy, and that would be 
pretty unlikely, too. (The chances of me finding a huge gem Sapphire are 
like me hitting the Power Ball Lottery!!)

Other than XRD or crossed Nichols, are there any other definitive tests for 
Topaz?

Larry

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Earl R. Verbeek" <everbeek at ptd.net>
To: "'Rockhounds at drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" 
<rockhounds at lists.drizzle.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 5:33 PM
Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] ID help

> Hi Axel,
>
> Trivalent chromium substituting for aluminum can (and does) cause red
> fluorescence in topaz.  I don't have the paper handy, but I remember one
> locality being given as Ghundao Hill (Afghanistan?).  As with corundum, a
> quantity of chromium sufficient to cause red fluorescence will not
> necessarily result in noticeable coloration of the mineral.  But I too 
> would
> like to know which UV wavelength causes the red fluorescence.
>
>           cheers-   Earl
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com
> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Axel Emmermann
> Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 4:07 PM
> To: 'Rockhounds at drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'
> Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] ID help
>
> Could you state the UV-band? LW, SW, medium wave or blue light.... That
> really matters ;-)))
>
> Is that an "intense" fluorescence or rather weak or medium strong?
> Would you describe the red as "cherry" or more a "velvety" red?
> Any "purple" in it or just plain red?
>
> I think the topaz is out.... That would fluoresce yellow or whitish.
> Diopside too, that would more likely fluoresce blue.
> Ziosite is not likely to fluoresce... Except thulite, the manganoan 
> zoistite
> which fluoresces orange to pink.
> Amblygonite??? Haven't heard of any fluorescence...
>
> Corundum??? That is certainly a good candidate! The diamond-shaped
> cross-section is indicative of that....
>
> Don't discard the feldspars yet... but try a blue laser. If they fluoresce
> REALLY hard in a blue laser beam then it is most likely corundum. A 
> spectrum
> would tell....
>
> I tried the crystals that you sent me... even the blue "sapphire" 
> fluoresces
> in blue laser light!
> If you stop and think about how the blue color is caused by iron... Iron
> quenches fluorescence in many minerals. Still in blue laser light... I'll
> try to make a photo, one of these days ;-)))))
>
> OK, lI'll bet it's corundum.
>
> Cheers
>
> Axel
>
> Axel Emmermann
> European Regional Vice President of the
> Fluorescent Mineral Society
> <http://www.uvminerals.org/>
> =========================
> Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen/Antwerp Mineralogical Society
> <http://www.minerant.org/index.html>
> Werkgroepleider/Workgroup leader: Fluorescerende mineralen/Fluorescent
> minerals
> Technische Realisaties/Engineering
> My website: http://users.telenet.be/axel.emmerman/FiatLux/Index.php
>
>
>
>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
>> Van: rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com
> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com]
>> Namens Lawrence Rush
>> Verzonden: dinsdag 23 juni 2009 21:01
>> Aan: Rockhounds at drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors
>> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] ID help
>>
>> Aha! They fluoresce a deep dark red! But, too hard for
>> feldspar.......getting any closer, Axel?
>>
>> Larry
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Axel Emmermann" <axel.emmermann at pandora.be>
>> To: "'Rockhounds at drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem 
>> collectors'"
>> <rockhounds at lists.drizzle.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 2:51 PM
>> Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] ID help
>>
>>
>> > Larry,
>> >
>> > Topaz would have a distinct cleavage.
>> > It breaks very easily in a plane that is perpendicular to the C-axis.
>> > If you'd drop one of those hey would easily shatter and break at the
> basal
>> > plane.
>> > I don't see that in you photos.
>> > If I were to bet... some feldspar? Orthoclase? Microcline?
>> > But zoisite and amblygonite are also possible...
>> >
>> > Any fluorescence?
>> > Come on, Larry... make it shine ;-)))
>> >
>> > Cheers
>> >
>> > Axel
>> >
>> >
>> > Axel Emmermann
>> > European Regional Vice President of the
>> > Fluorescent Mineral Society
>> > <http://www.uvminerals.org/>
>> > =========================
>> > Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen/Antwerp Mineralogical Society
>> > <http://www.minerant.org/index.html>
>> > Werkgroepleider/Workgroup leader: Fluorescerende mineralen/Fluorescent
>> > minerals
>> > Technische Realisaties/Engineering
>> > My website: http://users.telenet.be/axel.emmerman/FiatLux/Index.php
>> >
>> >
>> >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
>> >> Van: rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com
>> > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces at lists.drizzle.com]
>> >> Namens Lawrence Rush
>> >> Verzonden: dinsdag 23 juni 2009 18:51
>> >> Aan: rockhounds at lists.drizzle.com
>> >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] ID help
>> >>
>> >> I just got a box of minerals from Pakistan which contained 2 pieces of
> an
>> > unidentified
>> >> material. These are unfamiliar to me, and I need some help.
>> >>
>> >> The color is a sea green, translucent. The crystals are well formed,
>> > appear to be perhaps
>> >> Tetragonal or Orthorhombic. They have 4 distinct sides, diamond-shaped
> in
>> > cross section,
>> >> with  sharp low angle edges on 2 sides. The hardness is greater than 
>> >> 6.
>> > The matrix is quartz,
>> >> evidently a pegmatite mineral. No locality, but all of the others from
>> > this supplier were from
>> >> Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Waziristan.
>> >>
>> >> I suspect they are Topaz, but the shape and color have me questioning
>> > this.
>> >>
>> >> I posted photos on http://www.connroxminerals.com/temp.html
>> >>
>> >> Any thoughts?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks...Larry
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Noel Coward thought work was more fun than play,  but he never, ever
>> > worked in the mines"
>> >>
>> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
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