[Rockhounds] Re: Need ID of Massive Moh 7.5 Crystal

[Jim Marshall]

To All,
 
First of all I would like to thank all of you that responded very quickly to this message (after I was able to supply a picture :-)  Thanks especially to the people that wrote more than a page of analysis of their thought patterns.  I found this extremely helpful.

The consensus seems to be that it is glass of some sort.  I do not want to push my agenda or (my uninformed) conclusions on anybody, but I do want to make sure all possibilities for identification are exhausted before dismissing this thing.  I am going to give you more of the story now so that you know I am not a crackpot or am I trying to run a scam.

I received this rock from a senior monk of the village from where my wife originates.  He is highly respected in the village and has been ripped off by scam artists before because he is somewhat gullible.  He happens to trust my wife's family so allowed me to take the rock for examination and determination of value.  If I am able to sell it for a reasonable price, I am sure he would put the proceeds to good use to help this rather poor village.  If I am not able to obtain what I feel to be a fair price for it, I will simply return it to him.

Jesus, that sounds like the Nigerian email scam doesn't it?  Sorry but it is the truth.

My initial thoughts upon viewing it under a loop and seeing the bubbles was exactly what everybody else is saying: some type of volcanic glass.  Let me digress for a moment to help you understand why I don't think it is man made material.  This monk, often ventures out into the jungle for weeks at a time on meditation trips.  The area that he ventures into is extremely wild, with little intrusion by man.  Certainly no factories or anything like that.  There is probably some military activity and certainly a lot of land mines left over from prior conflicts.  So a man made source is pretty unlikely.  This also leads me to being pretty certain of its origin.  He has told me the area where he found it and I believe him.  It is mountainous (some possibly ancient, extinct volcanoes) and rugged.  Certainly not an area where many would go unless they are in really good shape.  It is unlikely that he would be looking for retreat in a place highly
 populated by man.  

Regardless of my initial thoughts, I took the rock with me to see if I could do some further research to clarify my untrained conclusion.  So I purchased the set of hardness pencils and conducted the test.  I found the test to be as simple as spit.  I cannot see how I got it wrong.  Everywhere I tested, the 7 point slipped without any attempt to "bite" into the material.  And the 8 easily scratched it.  I tried various pressures and contact points all with the same results.

So now I come to my main question.  Can anyone that thinks it is glass find any reference to glass testing out at more than Moh 7?  Everything I can find leads me to 5-6 as the hardness of glass.  Now if you were telling me quartz, OK that I might find a little more believable.  After all, quartz does sometimes show conchoidal fracturing (I've seen pictures and now know what that is).  And quartz is moh 7.  Not far from what this material tests at.

My point is - if this is anything else than quartz or glass, it is an extremely improbable find.  I accept that.  So I'm trying to determine if people's opinions are being formed on the basis of the improbability rather than what few facts are available.

Fact: hardness greater than 7
Fact: No pleiochromism exhibited under dichroscope.
Fact: conchoidal fracturing similar to glass, quartz, tourmaline and garnet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garnet)

Doubtful this is going to change the mind of anybody.  I have chiseled off a chunk and plan to try to get it identified.  But I must admit that there is some danger in this.  You see, I live in Thailand.  (Note to the person that said stuff like this can be found in the Chatuchak weekend market - that is not true as I am a frequent visitor and have recently haunted the rock shops there where nothing even remotely similar could be found)  This is not the US.  If someone here thought I had something of extreme value and they were part of the military say, they would not hesitate to roll a hand grenade through my front door if they thought that is what it would take to obtain it.  It is not like I can just walk down to the local jeweler to get it evaluated.  While many are skilled in that capability, few would give me a straight answer.  There is a local office of the GIA that may be able to help me.

Anyway, thanks again for the assistance.  I am still interested in hearing further opinions and when I can get some more information from direct expert examination I wll let everyone know.


----- Original Message ----
From: Jim Marshall <thai_buyer at yahoo.com>
To: rockhounds at lists.drizzle.com
Sent: Sunday, October 5, 2008 9:40:45 PM
Subject: Need ID of Massive Moh 7.5 Crystal


To all,


I need the help of a serious rockhound. My travels have brought this large crystalline rock into my hands. It weighs 2.15 kilos. It is a dark green, that transitions to brown with yellow/gold crystal encrustations. The green section is transparent / translucent while the darker composition is less so. Using a set of hardness pencils (points) I have done a scratch test and all results show - 7 does not scratch and 8 does. Locale of origin: Thailand / Cambodia. Based on the scratch test, it is obviously not quartz or glass. My best guess at the moment is a variety of green Garnet, but I am not sure which variety. Other less likely possibilities are beryl or tourmaline but neither comes from this area and I don't think either one is found in a similar size. You may email me (Jim) at: Thai_buyer at yahoo.com if you would like to discuss.  Picture link below:
 
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v177/thai_buyer/?action=view&current=IMG_0687.jpg
 
Thanks,

Jim


      

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